Getting a Hatch engineered in Victoria

[bomber]

I've had my car engineered and I just wanted to pass on some info regarding my experiences with the process for those thinking of doing the same.
My comments relate to getting a car engineered in Victoria. It's frustrating, but without a national road regulatory body the method of registration/engineering etc. and the individual rules of each state will be different, so take the comments with a grain of salt if you're in another state.
I have a Suzuki hatch with Alto works driveline.
I contacted the engineer to make a booking to see him. He was flat out and booked it in 6 weeks from my enquiry. I wanted to bring the car in for an initial inspection before hand to see if there was anything I'd need to change before the inspection. The engineer said that any inspection was a full inspection and we'd just go through everything on the day. If there was anything that needed to be changed he go through that with me on the day. I did raise however a couple of things with him I was concerned about. The half roll cage, wheels, racing harnesses and fixed back seats.
He advised me that the roll cage would have to be appropriately padded (referred me through to the Vicroads guidelines on roll cages), wheels were inspected and engineered with the car if oversized (couldn't scrub or make the vehicle unsafe to drive), racing harnesses were illegal and retractable seat belts had to be fitted and fixed back seats were fine as long as they were ADR approved.
After those comments, I removed the harnesses and put retractable brand new standard seat belts in, checked the rollcage padding (was sufficient from what I could see), wheels were fine and didn't scrub and I had to change over the fixed back seats to ADR approved seats.
Took the vehicle in to the engineer for the inspection. Gave him a long run down on the build complete with pictures of different things. Luckily most of the mounting points were the same and the entire driveline was converted with brakes from the Alto. So, he just had to certify the engine was put in correctly. The Hatch is an 83 build and has no ADR for emissions. There is also a policy in ADR for vehicles in 83 and prior that if you fit an engine below 800cc, there is no emissions requirements. I had a pod filter in an air box and plumb back BOV, but he said these could be changed to a free air pod filter and venting BOV if I wanted.
I have a sports steering wheel with a solid centre in the hatch. He said this was fine as the hatch has no adr for steering wheels. This means, I can fit whatever I want, as long as it complies with Vicroads regs that a wheel must be >330mm. But otherwise, a car must have an ADR steering wheel with a padded centre.
The rollcage was padded everywhere and he said I could remove all the padding as there was no way my head could hit the rollcage as it was all behind the headrest on the fixed back seats.
The car passed and I got my engineers certificate.
I'm working on putting together a Mira at the moment with a TR-XX engine and wanted some info regarding this car and how it related to the next car I was working on. Some interesting things he passed on during the process:

- The policy regarding 800cc engines as referenced earlier does not apply to my Mira as it is a 92 model. So, it needs to be established that the engine meets emissions requirements. Either by fitting a emissions tested engine or by having an emissions test. Although the engineer didn't recommend this as he said it was very expensive and if you fail, you've got to pay the fee again - can be $2000-$3000 a pop.
- Racing harnesses are 'illegal, but legal.' You must have the standard retractable belts fitted to the car on standard mounts. You must use the retractable seat belts on the road. However, you can have harnesses fitted, but can't use them on the street. I've heard that many reports about this, but this is what this engineer said.
- See comments regarding steering wheels above, but he said if you can, run a factory wheel. Much easier, less attention and he said most people actually run illegal wheels inadvertently..
- I was going to convert my Mira from 4 seater to 2 seater, but he said not to do it as this brings a heap of other things into play that you have to comply with. Just easier to remain 4 seater.
- Any aftermarket seat must be ADR certified. I took my previous seats out as were not ADR certified, although were FIA homolgated. He said the car may not have passed with the previous seats in. Also advised if not ADR certified, can also come into trouble even with an engineers cert as it can be up to interpretation as to whether they pass or not.

Big take home message for me was the fact that you only need to comply with the ADRs that your car is listed with. Big plus with the hatch, but will be a pain when the Mira is completed as it's a later model. I've already looked at the ADRs on the compliance plate on the Mira and there's a lot more listed there. The Hatch was also complied as a commercial vehicle so it got away with a few things there.

The rules might be a little open to interpretation, but I consulted with the engineer and the quick comments regarding the issues mentioned before were really worthwhile as if I'd taken the car in with harnesses and the original fixed back seats, I wouldn't have passed. That wouldn't have been a problem, it would've just meant another trip to the engineer.

It's a process not without headaches, that's for sure, in terms of what you have to do to comply, but all in all it wasn't too bad and knowing that it's really not that difficult, I'll be doing it again for any other modified cars I have.

[Brayden]

Sounds like what your engineer has said is in almost line with the latest DOTARS regs, and therefore concurrent with NSW/ACT as well.

One point I think he may have wrong is regarding the engine emissions and ADR compliance. The compliance for this should be based on the YOM of the engine's donor vehicle, not the recipient body - according to DOTARS anyway. Of course there is always room for interpretation.

Also the loophole for non-emissions compliance is a pre-86 engine under 850cc fitted to an ADR 27C vehicle. This is why I chose to turbocharge my F8B rather than install a later model F6A engine.

[Billie]

I was wondering why you spent so much money on a f8b to get the same performance as a f6a/k6a engine.

Wow its hard to get a f8b engineered down there.

All i did was get it inspected by queensland transport and they just wrote the new engine number and said thats fine.

[Brayden]

Engineering an F8B is easy, all it takes is a quick inspection by an engineering signatory who verifies all the changes, then an inspection by the RTA to confirm the new engine number and put it on your vehicle's record.

[Billie]

I'm just saying, i didn't need any engineers certs, the person who looked at my engine was the dude who sits at the computer. He just checked engine numbers and stuff.

[gadj]

I was surprised to see how much I was able to talk my way around. My MB was plated for a G10a & 5 speed but I had choice of F5a or F8b auto. I went F8b. I simply told the person at the counter that the F8b was just a bigger capacity engine that bolts straight in without modifications to anything & that the vehile was certified for a 1 litre anyway.
I got it registered without drama until they tried to tell me it was a sedan. A quick look out the window convinced them otherwise.

[ike849]

got to remember guys we live in QLD.......lawn mowers can be registered!!!!

still i'm not sure how you would go in a legal case if it was found out that your f8b wasn't engineered.........

[Billie]

If everyone reads the mods thing on qld transport they'll see if a engine can be transfered usiing original mounts and brakes and suspension, a mod plate is not required, just a inspection.

[holk]

Bomber,

PM sent re Engineer

Cheers,